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	<title>Comments on: From product to process</title>
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	<description>Collaborative storytelling for family &#38; friends</description>
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		<title>By: Justine Purcell</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-1020</link>
		<dc:creator>Justine Purcell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 03:45:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-1020</guid>
		<description>Such brilliant and inspiring ideas above! I&#039;m late on this, but I&#039;ve been thinking about it all day... and wondering.... 

If social collaborators are potential &#039;buyers&#039;, and are somewhat representative of the demand, the supplier/artist/creator can probably assume that this sea of collaborators (demand) is as infinite as the sea of ideas (product). Not that every product will be a success, but the audience is as fluid and malleable as the art.  Just as we can reinvent the product a hundred times, now we can reinvent the audience a hundred times, too. It’s infinite.

This is reassuring to me as a writer... with an unpublished novel. A few years ago, the timing for market-entry would have been hugely important – my book would be introduced to the world at point A and deemed big success or big flop by point B. There was very little that could be done “post” the point B milestone.

But now – I’m contemplating multiple launches (all free, of course), approaches, and even demographics. My work might click at any one of an infinite number of points in time or ‘place.’ Many junctures. Many opportunities. What used to be elusive (is there a market for my work? Who knows!) is starting to seem like something tangible and reactive – not quite transparent, but definitely within reach. It’s making me think that for good content/art, there is... an infinite supply of demand! Fluid and responsive and ultimately...pretty human.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Such brilliant and inspiring ideas above! I&#8217;m late on this, but I&#8217;ve been thinking about it all day&#8230; and wondering&#8230;. </p>
<p>If social collaborators are potential &#8216;buyers&#8217;, and are somewhat representative of the demand, the supplier/artist/creator can probably assume that this sea of collaborators (demand) is as infinite as the sea of ideas (product). Not that every product will be a success, but the audience is as fluid and malleable as the art.  Just as we can reinvent the product a hundred times, now we can reinvent the audience a hundred times, too. It’s infinite.</p>
<p>This is reassuring to me as a writer&#8230; with an unpublished novel. A few years ago, the timing for market-entry would have been hugely important – my book would be introduced to the world at point A and deemed big success or big flop by point B. There was very little that could be done “post” the point B milestone.</p>
<p>But now – I’m contemplating multiple launches (all free, of course), approaches, and even demographics. My work might click at any one of an infinite number of points in time or ‘place.’ Many junctures. Many opportunities. What used to be elusive (is there a market for my work? Who knows!) is starting to seem like something tangible and reactive – not quite transparent, but definitely within reach. It’s making me think that for good content/art, there is&#8230; an infinite supply of demand! Fluid and responsive and ultimately&#8230;pretty human.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-1016</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 01:37:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-1016</guid>
		<description>Historically, not all artists shared the same type of interaction with their fans. Comedians and musicians, for instance, create their act for a live audience and get immediate feedback that helps them modulate or edit their performance. But up until recently, authors and visual artists were more &quot;back stage&quot; and only met their fans at book signings or gallery events. Now that they have the option to interact with them before, during, and after their work, they have new types of decisions to make, most notably &quot;what am I comfortable with?&quot; 

For some, interaction is now a primary, driving ingredient of their work. It&#039;s still &quot;artistry,&quot; but it&#039;s artistry through the coordination of things and people. For others, fan interaction may simply be a way to get perspective before plunging back into the creative process. And for others still, fans are to be engaged only at specific times and with limited intent.

None of these choices are good or bad. Networks are just new tools to be used as an artist sees fit. And like many tools, their usage shifts over time as an artist explores their relationship with the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Historically, not all artists shared the same type of interaction with their fans. Comedians and musicians, for instance, create their act for a live audience and get immediate feedback that helps them modulate or edit their performance. But up until recently, authors and visual artists were more &#8220;back stage&#8221; and only met their fans at book signings or gallery events. Now that they have the option to interact with them before, during, and after their work, they have new types of decisions to make, most notably &#8220;what am I comfortable with?&#8221; </p>
<p>For some, interaction is now a primary, driving ingredient of their work. It&#8217;s still &#8220;artistry,&#8221; but it&#8217;s artistry through the coordination of things and people. For others, fan interaction may simply be a way to get perspective before plunging back into the creative process. And for others still, fans are to be engaged only at specific times and with limited intent.</p>
<p>None of these choices are good or bad. Networks are just new tools to be used as an artist sees fit. And like many tools, their usage shifts over time as an artist explores their relationship with the world.</p>
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		<title>By: _dger_</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-1014</link>
		<dc:creator>_dger_</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 00:57:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-1014</guid>
		<description>In terms of community influence on artistry, I don&#039;t think any artist owes anyone anything, really.  I recall Harlan Ellison speaking on Prisoners of Gravity many moons ago about a woman that harassed him on the way to the bathroom, insisting that he owed her an autograph for buying his book.  To which he replied, and I&#039;m paraphrasing horribly, I&#039;m sure, &quot;Lady, you know what you get when you pay $4.50 for a book?  A BOOK!&quot;

dger</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In terms of community influence on artistry, I don&#8217;t think any artist owes anyone anything, really.  I recall Harlan Ellison speaking on Prisoners of Gravity many moons ago about a woman that harassed him on the way to the bathroom, insisting that he owed her an autograph for buying his book.  To which he replied, and I&#8217;m paraphrasing horribly, I&#8217;m sure, &#8220;Lady, you know what you get when you pay $4.50 for a book?  A BOOK!&#8221;</p>
<p>dger</p>
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		<title>By: michael nobbs &#124; the blog &#187; The Unconventional Guide to Art and Money</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-1001</link>
		<dc:creator>michael nobbs &#124; the blog &#187; The Unconventional Guide to Art and Money</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 15:46:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-1001</guid>
		<description>[...] read an interesting blog post yesterday over on Storybird about this whole subject. A lot of my ideas were clarified after reading Seth Godins excellent [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] read an interesting blog post yesterday over on Storybird about this whole subject. A lot of my ideas were clarified after reading Seth Godins excellent [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jared Matthew Kessler</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-999</link>
		<dc:creator>Jared Matthew Kessler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 15:01:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-999</guid>
		<description>Some really great thoughts there.  

As an extension to that, people that don&#039;t create the NEED first will have a hard time succeeding.  As you said, failure is cheap BUT it can be expensive without people NEEDING what you have.  The trick then, is to find out what they &quot;need&quot; (not what we want to give or sell them - that we think is brilliant).  

A brilliant idea to me never means anything, unless something THINKS it is a &quot;brilliant&quot; idea for them (from a  business perspective).  As creative people we must understand this.  Once I did, I had my most profitable year (ONLY because I make things based on the needs of others, not my own).  I know it&#039;s REALLY hard for artists to do because we love to create, but as I look back at the few hundred cd&#039;s I have sitting in a box from 1997, I REALLY appreciate the importance of this.  

*Jared</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some really great thoughts there.  </p>
<p>As an extension to that, people that don&#8217;t create the NEED first will have a hard time succeeding.  As you said, failure is cheap BUT it can be expensive without people NEEDING what you have.  The trick then, is to find out what they &#8220;need&#8221; (not what we want to give or sell them &#8211; that we think is brilliant).  </p>
<p>A brilliant idea to me never means anything, unless something THINKS it is a &#8220;brilliant&#8221; idea for them (from a  business perspective).  As creative people we must understand this.  Once I did, I had my most profitable year (ONLY because I make things based on the needs of others, not my own).  I know it&#8217;s REALLY hard for artists to do because we love to create, but as I look back at the few hundred cd&#8217;s I have sitting in a box from 1997, I REALLY appreciate the importance of this.  </p>
<p>*Jared</p>
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		<title>By: Juan Gonzalez</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-997</link>
		<dc:creator>Juan Gonzalez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 14:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-997</guid>
		<description>Is it possible that too much attention at what your fans want will kill your creative soul?   Wouldn&#039;t that turn every artist into a paid contractor and every fan into a patron?  And if you never create a failure (because of the constant chattering with your audience), how will you distinguish the truly sublime?   I read this thread with the same skepticism that I read about &quot;social media&quot;.

However, I&#039;m far more interested in the by-products of the artists becoming so widely distributed that their art fuses with everyday language, allowing common people to express themselves with a symbolic language not too different from the fables of ancient mythology.  A Esperanto for the conversations that matter; a better construct for memes to spread.  That should be the legacy of technology becoming accessible to everyone:  its by-products should also be pervasive, free, reusable, remixed.  Would that be acceptable to you as an artist?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is it possible that too much attention at what your fans want will kill your creative soul?   Wouldn&#8217;t that turn every artist into a paid contractor and every fan into a patron?  And if you never create a failure (because of the constant chattering with your audience), how will you distinguish the truly sublime?   I read this thread with the same skepticism that I read about &#8220;social media&#8221;.</p>
<p>However, I&#8217;m far more interested in the by-products of the artists becoming so widely distributed that their art fuses with everyday language, allowing common people to express themselves with a symbolic language not too different from the fables of ancient mythology.  A Esperanto for the conversations that matter; a better construct for memes to spread.  That should be the legacy of technology becoming accessible to everyone:  its by-products should also be pervasive, free, reusable, remixed.  Would that be acceptable to you as an artist?</p>
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		<title>By: kaye</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-980</link>
		<dc:creator>kaye</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 03:28:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-980</guid>
		<description>I think of this like a self-perpetuating long-tail. I find an artist that suits me and my interests pretty well, I then interact with the artist and he/she modifies what they do to suit my interests. This (in theory) narrows what that artist does, and I travel ‘down’ the long-tail down to a more refined group of people with likes and dislikes even closer to mine. Maybe at some point, it&#039;s just between me and the artist — and that’s just fine if, as Adam puts it “both of [our] lives are enriched.”

However, it might not get to that 1-1 point, because the other side of course, is that while I *think* I know what I want, I like to be surprised and delighted by new things as well, so there is this wonderful give and take where I influence the artist, but the artist also influences me by opening up new areas of interest and engagement and I travel ‘up’ the long tail as my interests broaden.

So... &quot;What happens to artistic vision? To surprise? To auterism?&quot; I think it&#039;s all still there, it just depends on which way, on any given day, I feel like traveling on the long-tail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think of this like a self-perpetuating long-tail. I find an artist that suits me and my interests pretty well, I then interact with the artist and he/she modifies what they do to suit my interests. This (in theory) narrows what that artist does, and I travel ‘down’ the long-tail down to a more refined group of people with likes and dislikes even closer to mine. Maybe at some point, it&#8217;s just between me and the artist — and that’s just fine if, as Adam puts it “both of [our] lives are enriched.”</p>
<p>However, it might not get to that 1-1 point, because the other side of course, is that while I *think* I know what I want, I like to be surprised and delighted by new things as well, so there is this wonderful give and take where I influence the artist, but the artist also influences me by opening up new areas of interest and engagement and I travel ‘up’ the long tail as my interests broaden.</p>
<p>So&#8230; &#8220;What happens to artistic vision? To surprise? To auterism?&#8221; I think it&#8217;s all still there, it just depends on which way, on any given day, I feel like traveling on the long-tail.</p>
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		<title>By: guinevere de la mare</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-975</link>
		<dc:creator>guinevere de la mare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 00:34:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-975</guid>
		<description>Fantastic post, and great, thoughtful comments to boot. I have to stop and remind myself how remarkable it is that we have the luxury to debate these questions of community, innovation, self-publishing vs mass-market, etc, when the technology to create all of this was not even available or scalable only a few years ago. It&#039;s pretty amazing where we&#039;ve arrived in such a short time.

But before we get too starry-eyed over this brave new world of production possibilities, it&#039;s worth considering what makes something truly meaningful to someone. You can throw as much content and product out into the world as you want, but unless it resonates with someone at a deeper level, and serves some purpose or need for that individual, it&#039;s just a mountain of junk that becomes overwhelming and ignored as it grows. Consider Etsy—amazing success story, but the sheer volume of products on that site would be impossible to navigate without the filters and showcases curated by the editors. 

Community is irreplaceable as a sounding board for the voice of the people, but the role of the curator has also become more valuable than ever. The more we can facilitate dialogue between consumers and producers, the more we can create what really matters.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fantastic post, and great, thoughtful comments to boot. I have to stop and remind myself how remarkable it is that we have the luxury to debate these questions of community, innovation, self-publishing vs mass-market, etc, when the technology to create all of this was not even available or scalable only a few years ago. It&#8217;s pretty amazing where we&#8217;ve arrived in such a short time.</p>
<p>But before we get too starry-eyed over this brave new world of production possibilities, it&#8217;s worth considering what makes something truly meaningful to someone. You can throw as much content and product out into the world as you want, but unless it resonates with someone at a deeper level, and serves some purpose or need for that individual, it&#8217;s just a mountain of junk that becomes overwhelming and ignored as it grows. Consider Etsy—amazing success story, but the sheer volume of products on that site would be impossible to navigate without the filters and showcases curated by the editors. </p>
<p>Community is irreplaceable as a sounding board for the voice of the people, but the role of the curator has also become more valuable than ever. The more we can facilitate dialogue between consumers and producers, the more we can create what really matters.</p>
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		<title>By: Sara B.</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-974</link>
		<dc:creator>Sara B.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 00:19:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-974</guid>
		<description>Great posts and comments , as usual Storybird.

I think one of the biggest changes that has taken place is that the artist themselves (personality, opinion, thoughts about life) have become much more transparent and a part of the product and conversation that they share with their audience. The more the audience &quot;connects&quot; with the artist, their story and their process, the more attractive and interesting their product becomes and the web simply enables this. This isn&#039;t necessarily a new concept (branding theory) but now we&#039;re creating direct connections (and conversations) to people instead of product. This offers up new possibilities for artists and maybe even challenges too (for the traditional artist recluse) as what you say about yourself and your work can be evaluated as much as your product. In fact, what you say can sometimes even become more important (a product in itself). Do dry and boring blogs get as much attention as ones that are witty, thoughtful and entertaining? In that case, your work better be good enough to stand on it&#039;s own.. :)

It reminds me of the time before the interweb, when I would be much more inclined to purchase artwork if I met the artist and got a chance to hear the story behind it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great posts and comments , as usual Storybird.</p>
<p>I think one of the biggest changes that has taken place is that the artist themselves (personality, opinion, thoughts about life) have become much more transparent and a part of the product and conversation that they share with their audience. The more the audience &#8220;connects&#8221; with the artist, their story and their process, the more attractive and interesting their product becomes and the web simply enables this. This isn&#8217;t necessarily a new concept (branding theory) but now we&#8217;re creating direct connections (and conversations) to people instead of product. This offers up new possibilities for artists and maybe even challenges too (for the traditional artist recluse) as what you say about yourself and your work can be evaluated as much as your product. In fact, what you say can sometimes even become more important (a product in itself). Do dry and boring blogs get as much attention as ones that are witty, thoughtful and entertaining? In that case, your work better be good enough to stand on it&#8217;s own.. <img src='http://blog.storybird.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>It reminds me of the time before the interweb, when I would be much more inclined to purchase artwork if I met the artist and got a chance to hear the story behind it.</p>
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		<title>By: Amy Pritchard</title>
		<link>http://blog.storybird.com/2009/05/from-product-to-process/comment-page-1/#comment-966</link>
		<dc:creator>Amy Pritchard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 20:42:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.storybird.com/?p=612#comment-966</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ll jump in anectodally, I have no analysis.  OK, maybe I have some.

I got the idea for our company and then inserted ourselves into Newt Gingrich&#039;s appearance in Second Life.  Who knew that celebrity avatars needed bodyguard avatars?  Now they do.  :)

Essentially this is the time honored tradition of working for free and making yourself indispensable.   Start a blog, then run with the book.  Volunteer, then get the job.  Do your boss&#039;s work, then get the promotion.  

Be the friend, then get the girl.

I have a t-shirt that a great friend gave me that says &quot;DO EPIC SH*T&quot;.  I have always figured the fans, following, money, job, girl, boy, house, dream would follow that second.  In this day, with the world at our feet (with the cooperation of our internet service provider), somehow it is easier to convince people that what we are doing is truly epic.  Not that crocheting masterful wool sweaters in Northern Ireland and selling them to villagers is any less awesome.  But crocheting masterful wool sweaters online and selling them to millions, well that lands you on Oprah.  

Really, isn&#039;t that it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll jump in anectodally, I have no analysis.  OK, maybe I have some.</p>
<p>I got the idea for our company and then inserted ourselves into Newt Gingrich&#8217;s appearance in Second Life.  Who knew that celebrity avatars needed bodyguard avatars?  Now they do.  <img src='http://blog.storybird.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Essentially this is the time honored tradition of working for free and making yourself indispensable.   Start a blog, then run with the book.  Volunteer, then get the job.  Do your boss&#8217;s work, then get the promotion.  </p>
<p>Be the friend, then get the girl.</p>
<p>I have a t-shirt that a great friend gave me that says &#8220;DO EPIC SH*T&#8221;.  I have always figured the fans, following, money, job, girl, boy, house, dream would follow that second.  In this day, with the world at our feet (with the cooperation of our internet service provider), somehow it is easier to convince people that what we are doing is truly epic.  Not that crocheting masterful wool sweaters in Northern Ireland and selling them to villagers is any less awesome.  But crocheting masterful wool sweaters online and selling them to millions, well that lands you on Oprah.  </p>
<p>Really, isn&#8217;t that it?</p>
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